agents, contracts, marketing, publishers, publishing, query letters

Writers’ Mill Minutes Jan 2022

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The first Writers’ Mill meeting of the year was well-attended with over 20 members present. If you missed it, you missed a lively discussion with best-selling author John Hoover generously talking to us and answering questions for the whole two hours! Where else could we get such well-qualified one-on-one advice without spending half a fortune? Many thanks to John, to Joe for inviting him, and to Jean for making sure we got him on the schedule.

The meeting started with January’s contest results, announced by Judy since Von wasn’t able to be there—we miss you Von!

  1. Lyndsay D with her poem, Suspense before the Bells
  2. Steve C with his essay, Resolutions of a Wimpy Senior Citizen
  3. David F with his story, First Year Resolutions.

Other entries were:

  • Jessie C, poem “A Firm Resolve”
  • Judy B, poem “Birth of a New Year” AND story “Hot Air Resolutions”
  • Michael F, story “Boyfriend Resolution”
  • Darrel B, story “Holiday Adult Entertain Mints”
  • Sheila D, story “Kitkit’s New Year Resolution” AND poem “New Year 2022”
  • Robin L, list-poem “Resolutions for 2022”
  • Karin K, story “Stupid New Year’s Resolutions”
  • Zita P, story “The Un-resolution”
  • Peter L, story “Twenty-two Somethings”
  • Von P, story “Unresolved”

And upcoming contests (deadlines end of the first Sunday of the month, 1200 max word-count (no min), any genre, entries to contest @ portlandwritersmill . org) are:

Joe met our speaker, John Hoover, through a friend and was, himself, somewhat dazzled to learn he’d just met a New York Times bestselling author! John spoke to us last in May 2018 https://www.portlandwritersmill.org/23/john-hoover-on-idiots-and-publishers-may-2018/, and we were delighted to welcome him back—also very grateful that he was willing to return to us! John is the author of 15 commercially published works, 1 of which is a NYT bestseller (How to Work for an Idiot—https://www.amazon.com/Revised-Expanded-Idiots-Insanity-Incompetency-ebook/dp/B07J1FVZZ1/). His 2018 book, Enterprise-Wide Coaching—the Ten Commandments, was published by Sage Press in India (https://www.amazon.eg/-/en/Enterprise-Wide-Coaching-Commandments-India-John-Hoover/dp/B099SF4JFD ) and although most of his books are non-fiction, he also has experience in ghostwriting and playwriting (a one-act play, Viable: viableplay.org, https://www.christiancreativemedia.org/). He’s been published by Charisma Press, McGraw-Hill, Wiley, Harper Collins, St Martin’s Press, and more, and he has experience on both sides of the trying-to-get-published desk, as he can also claim to be the editor who rejected Men and from Mars, Women are from Venus! His advice: How to be poor and use up loads of time—be a writer!

John invited us to ask our questions, and generously spent his time advising us on:

  • How to choose a publisher/acquisition editor:
    • Find a (recent-ish) book that’s like the one you’re writing
    • Look at the copyright page to find the publisher
    • Look at the acknowledgements to find the editor who accepted the book. This person (if still in the business) is looking for books like this. They just might be looking for your book.
    • It’s better to contact the editor rather than the publisher. Acquisition editors are on the lookout for books that they can persuade the publisher to publish. They are looking for you—you just have to put yourself where they can find you.
    • If you’re trying to find an agent, the acknowledgements of a similar book is where you’ll look for agents who are looking for you too.
  • What if my book doesn’t fit any genre, and I can’t find books like mine?
    • Find books that have some points in common (even if a different age group)
    • Find books that might appeal to similar readers (even if a different concept)
    • Find books that have a similar message
    • If, say, you’re writing middle-grade Christian vampire novels, consider whether they fit with middle-grade Christian witches novels or YA Christian vampires. Google the concept and look at pages like https://www.perpetualpageturner.com/ya-vampire-books-for-teenagers/
    • Try to avoid books that emphasize something you’re not going to emphasize.
    • Then contact the editor/publisher: they might be looking to branch into your area, or they might have suggestions of who else you might contact.
    • Or even, contact the author.
  • How do I contact an acquisition editor?
    • Use the internet, LinkedIn, Google search, etc.
    • They’re not hiding. They want you to find them. They just don’t want all the world to find them.
  • What about trying to sell a series?
    • You sell a book. If the book sells, they might ask for the series.
    • So don’t wait until you’ve written the whole series.
    • In fact, if you’re writing non-fiction, don’t wait till you’ve written the book either.
  • How do I write a query letter?
  • What if I don’t own a similar book?
    • Go to the library or bookstore, look on appropriate bookshelves, and open the books to the acknowledgements pages
    • Or search Amazon by typing in your topic(s), use the “look inside” facility to read the acknowledgement page.
    • Make lists and tables of editors, publishers, agents, etc. Then contact them.
    • Helps if the books are recent so the agents, editors etc are still working (and not dead!).
  • Is the process different for fiction and non-fiction?
    • Yes. For a fiction book, you have to prove you have good writing, a good idea, and the staying power to finish the book. So you need to have a completed manuscript before you query.
    • For non-fiction, you write a proposal before you write the book.
    • For non-fiction, you might get paid an advance before you even write the book, and the editor will help direct you as you write.
  • What is an author-editor (acquisitions editor or other editor) relationship like?
    • In a good author-editor relationship, you might send the next chapter to your editor and get comments and suggestions by the end of the day. They’re excited about what you’re writing!
    • But ultimately, in fiction or non-fiction, the publisher/editor has the last say, not the author.
    • If you disagree fundamentally with where the editor is taking your work—if the finished work is going to misrepresent you as the author—then you have to walk away.
  • Do I need an agent?
    • Only 5 of John’s 15 books were agented.
    • Big houses might want you to be agented. Smaller houses less so.
  • How do I tell if something is a big house?
    • Look at its sales, book list, etc.
    • Looking at numbers and quality of reviews gives some idea of what sales are like for specific books. But for real information, you have to follow the paper trail.
  • How does the editor decide to accept or reject your proposal? Why does it take so long?
    • If it’s not the right topic or genre, they reject straight away.
    • Otherwise put it in a folder to look at next month.
    • If it’s not grown on them in that time, they reject it.
    • Otherwise wait and look at it again next month.
    • So yes, it takes a while. The longer it takes, the more interested they are.
    • You need an editor to fall in love with your book, so they can really push it to the publisher. Ditto for an agent. So, if they reject it, they weren’t the agent/editor you wanted. Doesn’t mean your book’s no good.
    • Don’t forget, you’re looking for someone who is looking for you!
  • Why do “big authors” get to write bigger books (more pages, etc)?
    • Because it’s easy to sell their book to the publisher
    • And it’s easy for the publisher to sell them to the bookbuyer in the bookstore
    • And it’s easy for the bookstore to sell them to readers. They know exactly which shelf to put them on, how to advertise them, etc.
  • What do I do with a rejection?
    • Read between the lines. Are they willing for you to resubmit? If they’re open to your replying, you might try to persuade them, say, that your long book is worth looking at because it’s so like another book that’s a huge bestseller…
    • Are they giving you useful advice (even if it’s not what you want to hear)? If they think your character’s not behaving believably, maybe you need more setup to give the character motivation.
    • Are they suggesting architectural changes? Step back and see if these changes really would improve your book.
  • What about places like https://www.inkshares.com/ that let you put your chapters in front of “readers” and publish the books that get the most readers?
    • Who are the readers?
    • How are the books marketed?
    • How well do they sell?
    • How to work for an idiot was heavily marketed and sold well. How to live with an idiot was not so heavily marketed and didn’t sell so well. It’s nothing to do with which book was better.
  • How polished do I need my book to be before I submit it?
    • If you’re searching for an editor, try finding one who’s sold books to major houses.
    • Choosing an editor can be a bit like choosing an agent.
    • You want to find an editor who will “sponsor” your book to the publisher
    • Might be spendy ($5,000) for this sort of service.
  • Are editors always authors?
    • No. The editor crafts the work of creative minds.
  • If we look for books that are just like ours, how will there ever be anything new out there?
    • They say they want new, but they don’t.
    • They want saleable.
    • They want no-risk.
    • New doesn’t sell, so even if it’s new, you have to make it sound safe and similar.’
    • Yes, new sometimes becomes great—Star Wars was rejected. So was Top Gun. But new takes a lot more effort to sell, and has to arrive at just the right time (right world situation) to catch the audience’s (readers’) attention.
  • What about film rights etc?
    • If a book moved to a different publisher, the contract probably moved to, so
    • Follow the paper trail
    • Find out who has the rights before negotiating.

John ended by reminding us that all this is hard work. You need to be passionate if you want to get your words “out there.” (You may even need to be passionate to get your words read by your grandchildren.) So… next month we meet on Feb 20th, same time, same place, and we’ll work on identifying and working into our passions.  We will send out a zoom link to everyone on our mailing list. If you haven’t got the link the day before the meeting, please check your spam folders. If you haven’t got it on the day of the meeting, please contact someone other than Sheila for help as she might be busy!

See you Feb 20th. Meanwhile

Happy Writing!

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